HOT TOPICS :
Gosip | COVID-19 | Ayo Vaksin
|
Thread Terpopuler
-
Sabtu, 2024/04/17 15:35 WIB
Media Asing Soroti Ledakan Turis: Tak Seperti Bali yang Dulu
-
Sabtu, 2024/04/17 15:40 WIB
Kota Wisata Sekelas Dubai Dilanda Banjir Bandang, Kok Bisa?
-
Jumat, 2024/04/16 14:03 WIB
Megawati Kirim Amicus Curiae ke MK: Habis Gelap Terbitlah Terang
-
Sabtu, 2024/04/17 14:58 WIB
Hai Warga Depok, Setujukah Pakaian Adat Diterapka untuk Seragam SD hingga SMA?
-
Sabtu, 2024/04/17 15:25 WIB
Sederet Tokoh Ajukan Amicus Curiae ke MK Terkait Pilpres 2024
-
Minggu, 2024/04/18 14:48 WIB
Kisah Pasangan 13 Jam Terjebak Banjir Dubai, Tak Ada Makanan Cuma Minum Air
|
Thread Tools |
20th July 2011, 13:20 |
#21
|
|
Addict Member
|
Quote:
BTW, I also want to express my graditute to Sigma officer for hosting me and RTN officer a lunch there, it is a good food and the chef is really mastermised in preparing the lunch. Hope we could met again. |
|
Last edited by vympel; 20th July 2011 at 13:59.. |
20th July 2011, 13:37 |
#23
|
|
Addict Member
|
Quote:
I am neither Indonesian nor Malaysian, since I am a thais. Please forgive me if my statement or info looks underestimated other parties, its my bad. Please forgive me reckless i am in sharing the info of ATM Orbat, since it looks unpleasant to others. To me, being a humble person is better, thus I also like to follow the Tzun Tzi rules of combat, knows your enemy first (as what I am doing now, look and learn..). I believe that neither Indonesian nor Malaysian will do the second confrontation era, no war is good for us..lets go for peace and harmony neighbouring friendship... I also agreed that most malaysia looks Singapore as a threat since Mossad office located there (and the Singapore defense program were advice by Israel). |
|
20th July 2011, 13:52 |
#24
|
|
Addict Member
|
Quote:
Sorry for not answering your question..my origin place is Chiang Mai, Thailand. Regarding to your question, to have bomber (maritime and land bomber, in medium capabilities), having bomber is a offensive policy, and no other country in asean region apply offensive policy. To me, its better choice if TNI can do an upgrade (the quantity and quality) for anti air batteries/system. Getting anti air in medium and long range and of course to upgrade the radar with passive system to avoind HARM from SEAD mode of enemies a/c more suitable comparing getting a new bomber jet due to the efficiency and the effecitveness. Attacking (offensive) other country will make our country in trouble, but shooting other a/c because of breaking our air space without permission is an act to defense our self. Different situation for diffrent terms, but the goal is same, to protect our home soil. |
|
20th July 2011, 14:50 |
#25
|
|
Addict Member
|
Quote:
to me, RMAF modernization program for a/c is for defensive policy, so, they will deploy their a/c to stop/defense their homesoil by doing maritime strike who offensive their country. Same term and tactical applied to other country. We cannot blame them if they in the process of protecting their country, instead we will be person who blamed due to our action on offensive other country. If TNIAU has the bomber a/c, so any operation on the a/c must be offensive mode (attacking other country), meanwhile Malaysian used different tactics which is to protect their seas boundry from been break by other vessel, and with that situation, they using defensive policy to ensure their act is move along with the UN needness. So, to me, no need for bomber to ensure that our country will not be blame by others and called bullied,furthermore, if our offensive mode is success, then thats better compare we offensive other country and then, we loose. Thats bad. And above all, living in peace is more better.. |
|
21st July 2011, 01:28 |
#26
|
Addict Member
|
Outstanding info mr vympel, its truly an absolute delight to have you participate in this forum.
I must say that RMAF make an superb decision by reducing their type rating and use a combination of eastern and western front-line fighter. Their decision to pick superbugs is also a great one, no other fighter as far as I no that combine a perfect balance between air dominance and ground attack as good as the superbugs. if RMAF finalize their superbugs aquisition program, will they be equipped with the latest gizmos? such as APG-79 AESA radar and ALE-55 fiber optic towed decoy system? And what weapon package will be bought by RMAF together with this purchase? And of the 24 a/c RMAF will buy, what's the ratio of the E single seat version and the F two-seat version? I think if we can know how much E version and how much F version that RMAF are going to buy, we can get a clear image of what role RMAF new superbug will be emphasized for (if more E version means more to air dominance, if F version more to ground attack). And if RMAF really buy an additional batch of flanker, it's a very good news for them, but not a good news for us, it'll mean that TNIAU will struggle to keep up with the RMAF. And i agree with the comparation of our flanker with RMAF flanker by Vympel. Our most capable flanker version. the Su-30MK2 is inferior compared to RMAF Su-30MKM. In term of avionics and agility. The greates advantage Su-30MKM version have over our flanker is their aiirborne radar, Bars PESA (as stated by vympel, the most powerfull radar ever produced for export by russia, while the most powerfull radar ever produced by russia is Irbis) while our own flanker are fitted with what literaly an enlarged mig-29 radar. And btw vympel, you stated that the new batch of flanker going to be bought by RMAF is likely to be equiped by AESA radar, what kind of radar is it? As far as i know, the only operational AESA radar made by russia is fitted to Mig-35. Is it an upscaled version of the radar found on Mig-35? From your explanation vympel, it's very logical for RMAF to enhance their maritime strike capability. And for that, i think its time for indonesia to incoporate area defense SAM to their fleet. Its frustates me to see the fact that all of our fleet is protected solely by MANPADS based SAM capable only for point air defense (including our latest SIGMA class). While malaysia, if i'm not mistaken, already install aspide SAM to one of their ship class. So as far as i can see, for TNIAL, the best possible procurement is a fully capable Air defense frigate to keep up with RMAF modernization program. From your info we can say that the future of RMAF will be centered around Su-30MKM and F/A-18E/F. While the RSAF will be centered around F-15SG and F-35. Our TNIAU is still uncertain of it future procurement, but as far as the progress shown, the future of TNIAU will be centered also on Flanker series, and the F-16. so vympel, what a/c will be the backbone of RTAF beside Gripen? |
21st July 2011, 08:58 |
#27
|
Mania Member
|
medium bomber not always use attack. It can be defense aircraft. If sometimes other country take one of many island in indonesia TNI-AL can using medium bomber to bomb cost line for open way to drop marines in cost lines
@Massive Indonesian a/c backbone for now is F-16A/B. Su-27/30, and F-5 and future is F-16 C/D, F-33 Golden Eagle (KFX), maybe in the future Grippen/Su-35/J-10/ PAK-FA |
21st July 2011, 09:16 |
#28
|
|
Addict Member
|
Quote:
|
|
Ajining diri dumunung ana ing lathi.... |
21st July 2011, 09:18 |
#29
|
Addict Member
|
Dear Mr Massive, thank Q for your replies. I will be happy to share what I know and please feel free to amend my opinion if is not precise or not true, since I also a human being like others. Well, as per your question,
1. RMAF knows and learned that to operate too many row of air fleet (streamlines) , i.e Su30MKM, Mig29N, FA18D Hornet and BAE Hawk is a nightmare in cost maintenance since they need to get the sparepart, technician in various sources. So, in their new Blue Print, they will trade their Hornet D version and Mig29N. First RMAF orbat are (as before), - Su30MKM for long range land strike - Mig29N for air intercept / air superiority - FA18D for night and maritime strike - BAE Hawk for close support land strike then, since they want to retired the Hornet D and Mig29N, the role of air intercept/air superiority and night and maritime strike already loose their player. Thus, RMAF stated a new Order of battle (ORBAT) via, - SU30MKM - air intercept / air superiority / air to air combat - FA18 E/F - land attack / maritime strike /and night strike * thats why we look that RMAF always prefer the upgrade version of their a/c so that they will be able to change their role of a/c easily. As before, MKM are dedicated for land attack capabilities and now they change it to air supreme a/c. ______________________________________ 2. Yes, as acknowledge by Boieng Co. before (somewhere in July 2010), US congress already release the full spec of Superhornet which is equip with AESA, BVRAAM, WVRAAM, ASRAAM, AGM and many more for RMAF. The issue is RMAF want AIM120C7, same version of RSAF instead of C5 version that they operated now... To ensure they get it, Malaysia Prime Minister has made a formal visit to UK last month and some of the agenda are to visit Eurofighter GmBH manufacturer (some of the candidate that offer a bid for contract in second MRCA program via their Typhoon), this act is to force the US Congress to release the BVRAAM C7 version. Noted that now, the jet fighter industry is to slow (world financial crisis) and each of manufacturer is stress out in selling their product, including Rafale, Boeing, Euro GmBH, Sukhoi Corp and many more. So, what they (Malaysian gov) do is to play push and pull game, so that US congress will release the selling of C7 due to ensure Boeing get the contract of RMAF second program. Loosing the contract means they loose some of their valuable profit sources.. * If TNIAU want to procure a jet fighter, now is the right time since we will get best offer, with best price and package. ____________________________ 3. RMAF will operate F version (FA18F Superhornet) since its a natural for them to have twin (tandem) seater a/c. Single seat a/c only suitable for short range operation and all the workload will only push to one pilot, thus, tandem seat is better. ____________________________ 4. About the difference between MK2 and MKM, its is due to the needness of the a/c. China doctrine is based on Soviet air combat warfare where the "quantity is superior than quality', thus they (PLAF) need a lots of Su30 MK2/Mk version with suite to their budget (to get more in quantity), thats why they ask Sukhoi Corp via KNAAPO to build an a/c with less payment (on of course by reducing the technology)..so that they will get the superior number. Because of this reason, thats show why MK2/MK and MKI/MKM version is different since MKI/MKM (By Irkut Corp) are tailored made for western air warfare which prefer "quality is superior than quantity". The problem (issue) are, if.. - if you want to get MK/MK2 version, then you need to follow Soviet strategies..which is to get more MK/MK2 version, at least 3 squadron. - if you want to get MKI/MKM version, then you need to follow western doctrine..which si to get more advance version although it is limited. * FYI, RSAF, RMAF and RTAF are following western airfare. ____________________________________ i will continue my explaination shortly, my officer is calling me. |
Last edited by vympel; 21st July 2011 at 10:07.. |
21st July 2011, 09:30 |
#30
|
|
Addict Member
|
Quote:
bomber a/c is a specialized a/c, which is to bomb in massive size, while 'strike' task which belong to MK2/MK/MKM/MKI are to do a precise/surgical strike, not in a huge area. what we should know is how a battle game played by enemy. In any crisis, the enemy will do SEAD/DEAD to elliminate the air defense (and radar), and the second step is to do a strike ops (like bombing by PGM @ precisision guided munition) to air force based, naval based and at the mean time, they will ensure no threat at the air i.e other jet and helo.. Once they get the 'air space', then the land/surface movement will started. (so, the real thing are when the enemy is taken an island in Indonesian, thats mean the TNIAU already gone/loose..) So, having bomber is no used since they cannot defense themself during the first wave of enemy offensive (SEAD/DEAD/ PGM Strike),the bomber a/c is too fragile only jet fighter (combat version) will be able to defense themself and be able to push back the enemy. So, having jet fighter is more needs compare having a bomber / unless we have a good number and quality of a/c and having a good range of anti air batteries. During the enemy doing the SEAD/DEAD and air superiority, what we should do to deploy our combat a/c (F16/Su27/30 MK/MK2) to push them back from controlling our air space, and of course with the help of anti air batteries. At this time, combat a/c is no used. A country should have a bomber a/c once they have a good number of combat a/c. Quote - a group of bomber a/c need at least 2 or 3 jet fighter as an escort, but via BVR, WVR all the bomber (which is bigger size, not agile) can be detect from far and can be shoot easily. |
|
Last edited by vympel; 21st July 2011 at 12:17.. |
detikNews
- detikNews · Berita · Internasional · Kolom · Wawancara · Lapsus · Tokoh · Pro Kontra · Profil · Indeks
- detikSport · Basket · MotoGP · F1 · Raket · Sepakbola · Sport Lain · Galeri · Profil · Fans Area · Indeks
- Sepakbola · Italia · Inggris · Spanyol · Jerman · Indonesia · Uefa · Bola Dunia · Fans Area · Indeks
- detikOto · Mobil · Motor · Modifikasi · Tips & Trik · Konsultasi · Komunitas · OtoTest · Galeri · Video · Forum · Indeks
- detikHot · Celebs · Music · Movie · Art · Gallery · Profile · KPOP · Forum · Indeks
- detikInet · News · Gadget · Games · Fotostop · Klinik IT · Ngopi · Produk Pilihan · Forum · Indeks
- detikFinance · Ekonomi Bisnis · Finansial · Properti · Energi · Industri · Sosok · Peluang Usaha · Pajak · Konsultasi · Foto · TV · Indeks
- detikHealth · Health News · Sexual Health · Diet · Ibu & Anak · Konsultasi · Health Calculator · Foto Balita · Bank Nama Bayi
- detikTravel · Travel News · Destinations · Photos · d'Trips · Hotels · Flights · ACI · d'Travelers Stories
- Wolipop · Fashion · Photos · Beauty · Love & Sex · Home & Family · Wedding · Entertainment · Sale & Shop · Hot Guide · d'Lounge · Indeks
- detikFood · Resep · Tempat Makan · Kabar Kuliner · Halal · Komunitas · Forum · Konsultasi · Galeri · Indeks
- detikSurabaya · Berita · Bisnis · Society · Foto · TV · Indeks
- detikBandung · News · Sosok · Info · Pengalaman Anda · Lifestyle · Iklan Baris · Foto · TV · Info Iklan · Forum · Indeks
Iklan Baris · Blog · Forum · adPoint · Seremonia · Sindikasi · Info Iklan · Suara Pembaca · Surat dari Buncit · detikTV · Cari Alamat
Copyright © 2019 detikcom, All Rights Reserved · Redaksi · Pedoman Media Siber · Karir · Kotak Pos · Info Iklan · Disclaimer